Creating music samples with vinyl records
Music sampling has been done for years using different techniques. Currently samplers (either as a piece of hardware or as software) is the most extended tool for playing samples that can come from digital formatted music, live recording, vinyls or tapes. One of the most old techniques for sampling was cut&paste the audio tape. I love this video from Delia Derbyshire using reel-to-reel recording, creating loops by cut&pasting the audio tape, and sync the samples to create music.
Driven by my devotion for vinyls and analog processes (perhaps a bit of Dj wannabe too), and emulating the audio tape cut&paste technique, I tried to make the vinyl sampling a bit more analog – literally cut and paste pieces of vinyl to create samples.
I bought some second hand vinyl records, different music styles: Supertramp, Wagner, Paul Anka, Chicago, Lil Jon and some random ones to make the first tests. I spend a couple of hours browsing and listening to old records – I remember thinking “all projects should start like this”.
Back to the studio, I considered different options to cut the vinyls – it had to be a clean cut in order to minimize the resulting groove and therefore the stress on the stylus.
I first used a hot wire cutter – it took some time to set the right temperature so the wire cut but didn’t deform the vinyl. It was quite important to keep a constant speed to avoid undesired melting too. I cut a small sector with the idea of reversing it afterwards, so a song from Side A would have a sample from a song from Side B.
The piece fitted quite well in its natural position but not in its reverse position. I had to smooth it out with a file, but there was already a serious gap and V-shape groove pretty difficult to resolve.
So I jumped into the second attempt, using a blade. It took around 50 passes to cut one straight line.
I cut a radial sector, it was slightly better than the first trial (no melted material) but I had to remove a burr with a file and again, it created a tiny gap, big enough to scare the stylus.
Then I tried the laser cutter and things went better.
I made many tests to find the right laser power in order to get the cleanest cut possible. The best setting was to let the laser go through *almost* through the vinyl, and then crack manually the last thin layer (1). If the laser goes all the way through, it melts too much material and leaves a gap (2). If the laser doesn’t go enough deep, it’s pretty much impossible to take the piece out without creating an undesired crack (3).
Even if the laser is well calibrated, it always cuts creating a cone-shape cut. Using the first option the crack doesn’t take out any material or creates burrs on the bottom surface, so that surface is the one I used for playing the record afterwards. The top one always have a gap where the stylus would go in.
I made some tests with different sectors to analyze repeatability and the cut wasn’t totally consistent on different positions of the disc and even on different positions of a sector. I think it’s due to the difference in resolution of the laser head depending of the combinations of X and Y axis speeds.
These are sectors from the same record, already exchanged, seen from the laser cut side:
And this is seen from the bottom side, where the final layer is cracked. Aligning the surfaces properly the gap is almost not perceptible by the finger:
The first time I placed the record on the vinyl player for testing, I noticed that the sectors were too small and it was difficult to guess which sample was it. The transition wasn’t clean – when the stylus found the groove it created a low sound (similar than a bass drum).
I decided to cut larger sectors on different records and exchange them to create loops or tunes using samples from different albums. I cut these patterns:
I cut the same angle in the label area so after the sectors were exchanged, I can remember which samples contain every record.
I exchanged the sectors from 4 different records: Paul Anka, Supertramp, Lil Jon and Chicago. I selected these four from the once I bought since they have the same thickness (1,2mm). The pieces snapped pretty well on its new position but I secured them temporarily with tape, so I could adjust the height and make the surface as even as possible before playing the record.
This are some of the resulting albums:
I made a video containing part of the process and the result, playing the records in a vinyl player.
It’s possible to hear (and see) the the stylus jumping a little bit – that’s not good for the needle. However this bumps create a new beat over the unmatching beats of the two samples, and that helps to define a new rhythm. I thought about selecting specific samples and make them match perfectly but that would work only for one rotation, so it might be good for scratching but not for listening continuously – it’s quite difficult to find records that the beat corresponds with a revolution.
It’s been an interesting experiment with a really fun process. I knew it would be, having vinyls, music and lasers involved :)
August 19th, 2011 at 9:57 am
[...] método analógico y artesanal empleado para hacer los muestreos se explica en Creating music samples with vinyl records, con un vídeo que muestra el proceso y algunos resultados del [...]
August 19th, 2011 at 11:01 am
[...] método analógico y artesanal empleado para hacer los muestreos se explica en Creating music samples with vinyl records, con un vídeo que muestra el proceso y algunos resultados del [...]
August 19th, 2011 at 11:45 am
[...] Informationen gibt es bei Ishac Bertran Amazon.de [...]
August 21st, 2011 at 12:55 am
[...] obtener el corte que necesitaba para que los samples tuvieran un sonido menos accidentado entre si, como explica en en su blog. El resultado y parte del proceso fué compilado en este video. [...]
August 23rd, 2011 at 4:39 am
[...] is a really interesting, ambitious and time consuming experiment that I’ve never seen before. Basically, Ishac Bertran cut out sections of one [...]
August 23rd, 2011 at 9:05 am
allgreatmusic.com…
ishback» Blog Archive » Creating music samples with vinyl records…
August 23rd, 2011 at 5:29 pm
[...] Más info http://blog.ishback.com/?p=918 [...]
August 25th, 2011 at 7:42 am
[...] Das ganze Ergebniss kann man in seinem Video bestaunen. Seine Fotos und Videos sind zu dem auch optisch sehr schön anzuschauen. Noch mehr Informationen über seine Arbeit und eine ausfürliche Erklärung findet ihr auf Ishacs Blog. [...]
August 25th, 2011 at 12:32 pm
[...] qu’il n’y a pas que la musique n’a pas toujours été numérique. Ishac Bertran, a créé un remix en utilisant quelques vinyle de sa collection et une paire de ciseaux. Une [...]
August 26th, 2011 at 4:34 pm
Nicely done! Always wanted to see something like this happen but without computer guided cutting it was just too iffy. Old pal Greg Fernandez used to do a much messier version which he called “flogging”, which goes like this:
Take a base record and put it on the turntable. Take a second record and break it — make sure the middle/spindle hole stays intact. Put that record on top of the base record. Play.
Much like this project, the result is that you sometimes get a loop, or sometimes the tonearm advances as usual, or sometimes it’s less predictable. And yes, of COURSE it destroys the needle. Best to use a Califone, Fisher-Price, or similar record player made for grade school child abuse.
August 27th, 2011 at 11:26 am
[...] Idee: Ishac Bertran stellt alles auf den Kopf und bastelt echte Platten neu zusammen, anstatt die Sounds am Computer zu [...]
August 29th, 2011 at 4:51 pm
[...] ishback via grandgood Tweet Read Related: Gear & Tech, Vinyl [...]
September 2nd, 2011 at 9:23 am
[...] AW: wirklich witzig… /* */ Creating music samples with vinyl records [...]
September 4th, 2011 at 10:55 am
[...] ????? ????????? ?????????? ?????. [...]
September 5th, 2011 at 6:26 am
[...] Ishac Bertran Blog – Sampling Vinyl zu Vinyl, Was ist Sampling? Antwort auf [...]
September 5th, 2011 at 7:35 am
[...] Music sampling has been done for years using different techniques. Currently samplers (either as a piece of hardware or as software) is the most extended tool for playing samples that can come from digital formatted music, live recording, vinyls or tapes. One of the most old techniques for sampling was cut&paste the audio tape. I love this video from Delia Derbyshire using reel-to-reel recording, creating loops by cut&pasting the audio tape, and sync the samples to create music. More information here: blog.ishback.com/??p=918 [...]
September 5th, 2011 at 12:49 pm
[...] Más información aquí:blog.ishback.com/??p=918 [...]
September 6th, 2011 at 9:15 am
[...] nástroj pre vyberanie kúskov z vinylu ako aj podrobnejší postup jeho práce nájdete na stránke A tu už je video ?asti postupu a výslednej [...]
September 7th, 2011 at 9:35 am
[...] es tiempo y paciencia. Básicamente, el diseñador con base en Dinamarca (nacido en Barcelona) Ishac Bertran lo que hace es recortar secciones de un registro y las reemplaza con secciones similares de otro LP [...]
September 10th, 2011 at 11:21 pm
[...] Experimental analog sampling with modified vinyls. Sectors from a vinyl record are cut and replaced by pieces with exact shape from other records. When played in a vinyl player the needle follows the grooves from both sectors creating sampled tunes or loops. [...]
October 2nd, 2011 at 11:40 pm
[...] 40 em diante. Mais informações sobre esse experimento, bem como o processo de tentativa e erro, aqui. Deixe seu comentário! Tags: analógico, laser cutter, sampling, vinil Clique [...]
October 3rd, 2011 at 9:15 pm
[...] cutting records and recording songs together to create new music [via] Daily Feeds Mashup http://blog.ishback.com/?p=918 Tags: analog, sampling, vinyl, [...]
October 4th, 2011 at 1:52 pm
VINYLS is NOT a word. its VINYL, like FISH.
October 4th, 2011 at 6:02 pm
[...] ishback» Blog Archive » Creating music samples with vinyl records "Driven by my devotion for vinyls and analog processes (perhaps a bit of Dj wannabe too), and emulating the audio tape cut&paste technique, I tried to make the vinyl sampling a bit more analog – literally cut and paste pieces of vinyl to create samples." Cut & Paste with physical vinyl; bonus points for excellent Delia Derbyshire video. (tags: sampling vinyl lasercutting music records ) [...]
October 4th, 2011 at 6:29 pm
[...] *NOTlabs [...]
October 4th, 2011 at 6:41 pm
When you laser cut vinyl it make Methane gas, something to think about.
October 4th, 2011 at 7:21 pm
2 thoughts
- how would it sound if you cut some spiral shapes, rather than going along the groove?
- you’d probably like listening to Eric Copeland
October 4th, 2011 at 8:43 pm
Nice work, wish I had time to do projects like this!
Not sure if it’s been said in the comments, as most of them are in a language I can’t read, but an *almost* surefire way to tell if a record has one beat per revolution is to look at the vinyl. A spiral pattern will be present if the beat almost matches one revolution, with the spiral obviously getting tighter the more even the beat-to-revolution ratio gets. Seems to be most common in thick grooved 12″ house singles though…!
Amazing post, love it! Thanks!
Eddie.
October 4th, 2011 at 9:17 pm
Christian Marclay has been doing this since the 80s, but not with the groove. Nice.
October 4th, 2011 at 9:37 pm
can you cut PVC with a laser? always heard that you can’t cut PVC, cause the chlorine in the burning process will damage the machine.
October 4th, 2011 at 11:03 pm
[...] veja mais [...]
October 5th, 2011 at 1:18 am
[...] (Read about the process of making this on Ishac’s site) [...]
October 5th, 2011 at 11:29 am
[...] Music sampling has always been right on the edge of music technology, but ironically Ishac Bertran has found a way to embrace a brand new technology in order to give a big wet kiss to to an older one. By using a laser cutter, Bertran has developed a technique of cutting out radial segments of old vinyl records and replacing them exactly the same size replacement pieces from different records. Yes I know what you’re thinking: why the hell didn’t I think of that?! Take a look at the terrific demonstration video below to see what I’m talking about. And for a more detailed explanation of Bertran’s technique be sure to visit his blog by CLICKING HERE. [...]
October 5th, 2011 at 1:49 pm
You should seek out records that are either 133.3bpm played at 33rpm or 90bpm played at 45rpm. Or at least fairly close to these tempos. Choosing these tempos will mean that you have a neat 2 or 4 beats per revolution of the disc and your new hybrid rhythms will feel less disjointed. Plenty of records in existence in this bpm range.
October 5th, 2011 at 1:55 pm
[...] Read more about the process on Ishac’s blog. [...]
October 5th, 2011 at 6:31 pm
[...] designer Ishac Bertran created ingenious analog remixes by cutting pieces out of vinyl records with a laser cutter and placed those pieces into other [...]
October 5th, 2011 at 6:41 pm
Yep. Christian Marclay did it this stuff using a fine saw…. But he did many of his cut-up records with picture discs and colored vinyl.
October 5th, 2011 at 9:54 pm
[...] Project Page [...]
October 5th, 2011 at 11:32 pm
FYI and for not reinventing again the wheel..check this out..LP cut-up and much more..Christian Marclay mini documentary – YouTube – goo.gl/JoSfo
October 6th, 2011 at 12:07 am
get a job
October 6th, 2011 at 10:32 am
nice crazy idea! “physical sampling/rearranging” would have been a more exact description of the process….
October 6th, 2011 at 8:44 pm
[...] Check out the full scoop here. [...]
October 7th, 2011 at 10:08 am
[...] ishback» Blog Archive » Creating music samples with vinyl records. [...]
October 7th, 2011 at 4:46 pm
Analog Vinyl Sampling…
By carefully laser-cutting, then mashing up segments of vinyl records, designer Ishac Bershan manages to make (crudely) sampled music without need for a digitizer – just an unhappy needle…….
October 9th, 2011 at 4:39 pm
[...] blog.ishback.com [...]
October 9th, 2011 at 6:42 pm
[...] Bertran has done this very interesting job of creating sampled albums using a laser cutter. He had the idea, but cutting turned out to be the biggest issue. you can see from his blog that he [...]
October 10th, 2011 at 10:53 am
[...] Creating music samples with vinyl records [ishback.com] [...]
October 11th, 2011 at 3:05 pm
[...] designer Ishac Bertran created ingenious analog remixes by cutting pieces out of vinyl records with a laser cutter and placed those pieces into other [...]
October 12th, 2011 at 5:35 pm
[...] Von Ishac Bertran. [...]
October 13th, 2011 at 2:11 pm
[...] posted the entire procedure on his blog, along with notes on how he first experimented with a hot wire cutter and even a utility knife [...]
October 15th, 2011 at 3:35 am
Does Girl Talk know about this yet?
October 17th, 2011 at 7:45 am
[...] Nice That reports: Ishac Bertran has taken the world of audio sampling back a few decades to a time before music went digital. Using [...]
October 27th, 2011 at 10:23 pm
VERY GOOD AT THE SAMPLES
October 30th, 2011 at 11:44 pm
[...] informações no Blog do Ishac-ac-ac-ac-ac-ac-ac-ac [...]
November 2nd, 2011 at 6:16 am
Can you elaborate on the laser cutter you used? Not sure I know what one is, what it looks like, or where to get one! Thanks. Great post.
November 5th, 2011 at 3:28 pm
wow !
it remids me of my earlier experiences with records back in 1984.
this is the cover of the fsirts album 1989
http://www.actuellecd.com/fr/cat/am_017/
bonne journée
martin
November 12th, 2011 at 7:03 pm
[...] coffee, Walter’s piano, Walter’s mystery beatbox Analog vinyl sampling d’Ishac Bertran Dubstep Beatbox Dubstep : décryptage d’un phénomène musical chez MusikPlease Dubstep [...]
November 17th, 2011 at 9:48 am
[...] Experimentation de sample modifié sur vinyle Par B.M. le nov 17, 2011 • 9 h 48 min Pas de commentaire Ishback Bertran expérimente la modification de vinyles pour créer des samples anlogiques. Il découpe et remplace certaines pièces du disque aux formes exactes ce qui crée des boucles et un changement de son lorsque l’aiguille suit les microsillons. Plus d’infos ici. [...]
December 3rd, 2011 at 5:25 am
Nicely done! Always wanted to see something like this happen but without computer guided cutting it was just too iffy. Old pal Greg Fernandez used to do a much messier version which he called “flogging”, which goes like this:
January 4th, 2012 at 7:35 pm
Mate you have way, way too much time on your hands!
I’d rather be mixing with three decks!
January 5th, 2012 at 5:49 am
Ishac – my hat is off to you for taking on an awesome project like this. You’re like a modern day Jean Michel Jarre… this is incredibly inventive and while might not have resulted in exactly what you wanted the first time around, if you nailed it with a few records it could absolutely light up a party. Nice work!
January 8th, 2012 at 6:24 am
Very interesting. A mix of some vinyl art we can see (and buy) on the Net but with the sound. Redifinition of a musical puzzle.
January 8th, 2012 at 6:46 pm
Tu sei malato! Lasciatelo dire. E curati! Secondo me uno come te ha la nonna a tocchetti nel congelatore. E non vede una figa dal giurassico! Ripigliati!
January 9th, 2012 at 12:09 am
music library…
[...]ishback» Blog Archive » Creating music samples with vinyl records[...]…
January 9th, 2012 at 1:36 am
Music and Recording…
[...]ishback» Blog Archive » Creating music samples with vinyl records[...]…
January 30th, 2012 at 9:11 pm
This is simply impossible. It is impossible that you could cut the vinyl and align with those tools and that the needle does not skip. When you cut the vinyl with heat, melt the edges, you lose the continuity of the tracks and the needle jumps.
Neither do I think you can have synchronized the drums of both songs because we are talking about microscopic precision and you are using toy tools!
March 6th, 2012 at 8:04 pm
great, so cool ….
Technical question: what laser you used? what power? I am very interest to try this idea? thank you for answering me and I gave details. Greetings from Switzerland.
Steph
March 18th, 2012 at 3:00 pm
[...] recently came across a project by the multimedia artist Ishac Bertran who has developed an interesting way of making analogue remixes. In the post-mashup age of vinyl resurgence and exchange-shop excess, [...]